Unpopular Opinion: The Team Aspects of KF and WotM make the raids overall much more frustrating and even less fun.

I'd like you to take a moment to think back to year one, back to the days of VoG and CE. Back when the bosses had to be killed by one or two "relic wielders" and the rest of the team pretty much had to just “go with the flow” in order to complete the raid.

Now come back to right now, with the “two” raids that are relevant right now (yes, I know Kings Fall is not really considered relevant, but it was the first raid that followed the new system, and it can still help you to get good gear). In which every single member of the team plays some role or another (even if it’s as small of a role as add control, they’re the only ones doing add control/the only ones controlling their group of adds). Each one of these roles is critical to the raid and if one person messes up the role then the best that could happen is they lose a damage phase (the worst is a wipe).

Overall, this new system works much better on paper, and I’m sure that for many of destiny players (specifically the ones with consistent raid teams) it works better in practice as well. But from my position, it doesn’t work much better on paper. I consider myself to almost be a hardcore player, I love and understand the game well enough, but I rarely get enough time to play. Because of this, I don’t have a consistent raid team and have to rely on sites such as LFG and the Recruitment tools on the destiny site, resulting in a very… “inconsistent” raid experience. Although there are many times when I’d hook up with a fireteam, start the raid, and breeze through it, there were also many times when my team simply couldn’t understand the raid and we’d spend hours on a single encounter. The majority of times when I tried to play kings fall in year two, I’d get put in a fireteam of at least one, if not two players who hadn’t done the raid before. Initially I’d just brush it off “there’s a first time for everything” “not all players have had the chance to play yet, I should still be fair to those who haven’t”. But an hour or two later I’d still find myself at the totems checkpoint, wondering how we’d get through the warpriest checkpoint and downright dreading Oryx (if we even made it there). Because of this, I had A LOT of trouble completing the raids, so much so that I didn’t complete the KF hard mode raid until towards the end of year two. And I still find that the same is true regarding WOTM and year three. I can normally complete easy mode with little-to-no trouble, but I have so far been unable to consistently get past vosik, particularly when it’s a challenge mode.

Now, I realize that there are undoubtedly a plethora of separate factors in play. Many Players do have consistent raid team who all know what their doing. I’m also not an expert, I do not, and have not ever claimed otherwise, it would be naive and arrogant to think that I am not part of the problem (at some level or another). Perhaps And there’s also the possibility that I’m just extremely unlucky. But I still can’t help but shake the feeling that the new format is contributing to this to some degree.

Take the Oryx/daughters encounter for example. There are 6 players on a team, One becomes the runner, three cover plates (or four depending on which strategy you’re using), one is the floater, and the remaining guardian is either a secondary floater and covers add control. Two issues with this. If more than two people die then the entire team will wipe if they don’t respond quick enough, and even if they do, then everybody has to contribute to add control. Secondly, There are four major roles which MUST be filled (runner and the plates). If any of these roles mess up, if the plates get the order wrong, or if the runner falls off of a platform, then the entire team will wipe. Although these are fairly simple tasks, and mistakes like that aren’t that easy to make… you’d be surprised. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve wiped because a Kings Fall newbie messed up the order (or didn’t understand the meaning of counterclockwise).

To be fair, WotM handles issues like that much better. But especially with the challenge modes, I often get put with try-hards who insist that we wipe when we lose the challenge mode, or how many times we had to wipe when one guardian dropped the cannons off the cliff in the Aksis encounter. Or how many times my team failed to throw the bombs at vosik at the same time. These errors are significantly less common than errors in the Kings fall raid, but they are still present.

Don’t get me wrong, I still do prefer the new layout over the old one, “hero moments” undoubtedly took away a lot of the fun from many players, and this new method guarantees that everyone will contribute, rather than having two players who just get carried through the entire raid. But this system is still extremely imperfect, and I do hope that bungie will address these issues with the next raid, as I find that they really retract from the two main incentives of raids: Fun (playing the same encounter tends to become somewhat boring after two hours) and gear (why bother even starting the raid if you can’t expect to finish any encounters and get new gear) What do you guys think? I know that I may very well be the only one to experience this, but I want to verify that I’m not the only one to notice this.

Edit: A lot of people are downvoting this, I just want to give a reminder that downvotes are meant for posts that don't contribute to the discussion, not posts that you disagree with. If you think I'm wrong then please feel free to post a comment below, or if you don't care that much, just move on, but downvoting is just petty.

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